Watch and Learn - Lib Dems: Spending on child poverty saves money in the long term

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I'm guessing actually that you liked

some of the budget. What about would I

some of the budget What about would I

be right in thinking that you like the

lifting of the two child benefit cap but

you didn't like the freezing of tax

thresholds?

thresholds

>> Correct. So um we do support the lifting

>> Correct So um we do support the lifting

of the two child benefit cap for two

reasons. First of all, we think it is

reasons First of all we think it is

morally the right thing to do. And

morally the right thing to do And

secondly, because it saves money for the

secondly because it saves money for the

taxpayer in the longer term because we

know that children growing up in poverty

ends up costing the taxpayer more

because they have worse health outcomes,

because they have worse health outcomes

worse educational outcomes as well. Uh

worse educational outcomes as well Uh

we support uh the government's attempts

to increase taxes on the remote gaming

companies, for example. So those are

companies for example So those are

good things uh that we do like, but we

good things uh that we do like but we

are deeply concerned deeply concerned

about this double whammy stealth tax on

both households and on high streets. I

both households and on high streets I

want to come to to all of that, but um

want to come to to all of that but um

this is unusual for Liberal Democrats.

this is unusual for Liberal Democrats

You you you guys all have an eye to

popular policies and lifting the cap is

a pretty unpopular po policy because

people say

you have a choice these days about how

many children you have and why should we

subsidize when we have decided to have

only two children. Why should we

only two children Why should we

subsidize people who want to have more?

subsidize people who want to have more

Honestly, I think politicians have not

Honestly I think politicians have not

gone out and sold the argument on this

one. The fact is that if you don't

one The fact is that if you don't

subsidize them, to use that word, uh

subsidize them to use that word uh

when they're growing up as children, we

when they're growing up as children we

end up subsidizing them lifelong. And

end up subsidizing them lifelong And

so, you can save money in the public

so you can save money in the public

purse. If you invest in children when

purse If you invest in children when

they're young, they get better health

they're young they get better health

outcomes, better educational outcomes.

outcomes better educational outcomes

They're less likely to be unemployed as

adults. So if we want to tackle the

adults So if we want to tackle the

welfare bill which is projected to grow

and grow and grow, one of the best ways

and grow and grow one of the best ways

of doing that is to invest early on so

you save later on. Uh though uh let me

you save later on Uh though uh let me

put to you something that Kathy Ashton

who's on the panel today and who was a

Labour minister um said which is that

when she was in government the money

what they put money into was Sure Start

and there are many people including

David Blunkett former cabinet minister

who've been saying this week that

actually if you had three billion to

spend

>> that is a more effective way of of using

it rather than giving three and a half

thousand people uh pounds to people who

may or may not use it well may or may

not use it to support their children.

not use it to support their children

>> But there are lots of different ways in

which you could spend this money. Of

which you could spend this money Of

course there are. So there are different

course there are So there are different

interventions we can have that argument.

interventions we can have that argument

But there's absolutely no doubt that the

vast majority of um child poverty

charities have said if you want to do

this instantly, if you want to have an

this instantly if you want to have an

instant impact, this is the fastest way

instant impact this is the fastest way

of having an instant impact on child

poverty today.

poverty today

>> All right. One one item um I wasn't sure

>> All right One one item um I wasn't sure

you would like in the budget is the um

council tax sir charge on homes over 2

million. Um you for that or against it?

million Um you for that or against it

>> We're against it because it's just such

a mess. Economists from left to right

a mess Economists from left to right

have said in the last few days this is

very complicated. It's a messy system.

very complicated It's a messy system

It won't come into effect for three

years and it's going to raise 400

million pounds. If the chancellor wants

million pounds If the chancellor wants

to go after wealth, we have said why not

to go after wealth we have said why not

raise a windfall tax on the big banks.

raise a windfall tax on the big banks

You could raise 30 billion pounds in the

next 5 years. If you want to go after

next 5 years If you want to go after

wealth, then why not reform capital

wealth then why not reform capital

gains tax in a more progressive fairer

way so the 0.1% super rich pay more. If

way so the 01 super rich pay more If

the government is serious about going

after wealth, they could raise a digital

after wealth they could raise a digital

services tax on people like Elon Musk

and Mark Zuckerberg. The all three of

and Mark Zuckerberg The all three of

those measures would raise significantly

more than 400 million from tweaking a

system that's could be ever so

complicated. So, I think the government

complicated So I think the government

needs to get its priorities straight.

needs to get its priorities straight

Well, you're you you um have a priority

Well you're you you um have a priority

of your own, which is to tax big

of your own which is to tax big

business, and you said you've mentioned

business and you said you've mentioned

two kinds of big businesses. Um big

two kinds of big businesses Um big

businesses, of which there are by the ONS

businesses of which there are by the ONS

definition, 8,000 or so, employ 11

definition 8000 or so employ 11

million people in this country, 40% of

million people in this country 40 of

the workforce. and they're going to be

the workforce and they're going to be

saying tomorrow morning to each other

that they need to slow hiring because

national insurance hike and now because

of business rates. Um,

of business rates Um

>> you're going to kill if you were in

government, you'd be killing growth,

government you'd be killing growth

wouldn't you?

wouldn't you

>> No, we absolutely wouldn't. We have been

>> No we absolutely wouldn't We have been

calling for measures that would boost

growth. We have singled out particular

growth We have singled out particular

businesses and particular sectors where

we think they could pay more money. So

we think they could pay more money So

for the big banks, for example, the

for the big banks for example the

windfall tax that we're calling for is

not a tax on the profits they've made

from lending any money. It's the money

from lending any money It's the money

that they've made from doing

nothing at all, from taking no risk at

nothing at all from taking no risk at

all because of a glitch in the

quantitative easing process. When you look

quantitative easing process When you look

at the digital services tax, this is a

at the digital services tax this is a

tax that would be levied on these

really, you know, these billionaires, the

really you know these billionaires the

richest man in the world. I don't think

richest man in the world I don't think

you can honestly say that these

particular sectors could

>> you're not seriously saying Elon Musk is

going to pay a welfare bill. Pensions

going to pay a welfare bill Pensions

alone knocking on

130, 140 billion. Even Elon Musk hasn't

130 140 billion Even Elon Musk hasn't

got that kind of money.

got that kind of money

>> Look, when you add up all of these

>> Look when you add up all of these

different measures that we're calling

for, it does add up to billions of

for it does add up to billions of

pounds. And also, we said you've got to

pounds And also we said you've got to

grow the economy. We can't keep talking

grow the economy We can't keep talking

about just taxing or cutting. We have

about just taxing or cutting We have

got to grow our way to prosperity. And

got to grow our way to prosperity And

the best way of doing that is getting a

better deal with Europe, which even

better deal with Europe which even

within the government's own red lines

would bring in an extra 25 billion

pounds a year.

pounds a year

>> Okay, so rejoin the EU.

>> Okay so rejoin the EU

>> Look, that's not on the cards right now.

>> Look that's not on the cards right now

What is on the cards is getting a better

deal with Europe. There's so much red

deal with Europe There's so much red

tape, so much red tape affecting British

tape so much red tape affecting British

businesses in this country right now. If

businesses in this country right now If

the government got a better deal and got

rid of two billion bits of paper that

businesses have had to complete since

the Brexit deal, we could improve

the Brexit deal we could improve

growth. You could have British

growth You could have British

businesses exporting abroad. That would

businesses exporting abroad That would

bring extra revenue into the public

purse to pay for our public services.

purse to pay for our public services

>> Okay, last quick questions. How worried

>> Okay last quick questions How worried

about are you about the fact that Mr.

about are you about the fact that Mr

Zach Polansky is hogging the limelight

as a sort of leftish receptacle for

disillusioned Labour voters?

disillusioned Labour voters

>> Zach is clearly a very charismatic guy,

>> Zach is clearly a very charismatic guy

but when you look in the ballot box, we

but when you look in the ballot box we

Liberal Democrats have been absolutely

winning in so many of the bi-elections

recently in many places where the green

vote has been going down. So we're

vote has been going down So we're

pretty confident that where we are

fighting hard, we are doing

fighting hard we are doing

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