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my guest tonight. He is an independent
my
guest
tonight
He
is
an
independent
senator from Vermont. His latest book is
senator
from
Vermont
His
latest
book
is
called Fight Oligarchy. Please welcome
called
Fight
Oligarchy
Please
welcome
to the program Senator Bernie Sanders.
to
the
program
Senator
Bernie
Sanders
Sir,
Sir
Fair enough.
Fair
enough
>> Been here 20 years. Never as much as a
>>
Been
here
20
years
Never
as
much
as
a
John.
John
>> Only you, brother. Uh, first of all,
>>
Only
you
brother
Uh
first
of
all
thank you for being here. How were uh
thank
you
for
being
here
How
were
uh
these no king rallies? You went, you
these
no
king
rallies
You
went
you
addressed one. Where where did you
addressed
one
Where
where
did
you
speak? What was
speak
What
was
>> in DC? There were some 200,000
>>
in
DC
There
were
some
200000
people out in DC.
people
out
in
DC
Uh there were some 7 million people out
Uh
there
were
some
7
million
people
out
in 2600 events all over the country, not
in
2600
events
all
over
the
country
not
only in big cities but in small towns.
only
in
big
cities
but
in
small
towns
Bottom line, extraordinary people came
Bottom
line
extraordinary
people
came
out. They said no to Trumpism, no to
out
They
said
no
to
Trumpism
no
to
authoritarianism,
authoritarianism
no to oligarchy.
no
to
oligarchy
It was uh uh and it and it grew from the
It
was
uh
uh
and
it
and
it
grew
from
the
previous uh expression of those. And
previous
uh
expression
of
those
And
obviously you can go back and you can
obviously
you
can
go
back
and
you
can
say well it's you know maybe the left is
say
well
it's
you
know
maybe
the
left
is
building a similar thing uh to to the
building
a
similar
thing
uh
to
to
the
tea party with all this
tea
party
with
all
this
potential energy
potential
energy
that's moving in that direction.
that's
moving
in
that
direction
How do you harness that for purpose for
How
do
you
harness
that
for
purpose
for
being directional? There not a lot of
being
directional
There
not
a
lot
of
people out there other than yourself,
people
out
there
other
than
yourself
other than Representative Cortez, who
other
than
Representative
Cortez
who
are very clearly delineated about a
are
very
clearly
delineated
about
a
point of view that people can rally
point
of
view
that
people
can
rally
behind.
behind
>> Well, let me just say two things. We are
>>
Well
let
me
just
say
two
things
We
are
in an extraordinarily dangerous time, as
in
an
extraordinarily
dangerous
time
as
you know. You got an authoritarian
you
know
You
got
an
authoritarian
president who wants more and more power,
president
who
wants
more
and
more
power
doesn't respect the Constitution,
doesn't
respect
the
Constitution
doesn't respect the law.
doesn't
respect
the
law
>> Well, Supreme Court that's granting it
>>
Well
Supreme
Court
that's
granting
it
to him,
to
him
>> right? That's true. I mean, that's part
>>
right
That's
true
I
mean
that's
part
of the process. I mean, you got a
of
the
process
I
mean
you
got
a
Republican party that's now lock step.
Republican
party
that's
now
lock
step
It's kind of a cult of the individual.
It's
kind
of
a
cult
of
the
individual
We got to stop him. But there's
We
got
to
stop
him
But
there's
something else that we got to do, John.
something
else
that
we
got
to
do
John
We have to have a vision for the future
We
have
to
have
a
vision
for
the
future
of this country.
of
this
country
>> And and I I think that many of my my
>>
And
and
I
I
think
that
many
of
my
my
colleagues in the Democratic party have
colleagues
in
the
Democratic
party
have
not had that vision. And what what that
not
had
that
vision
And
what
what
that
means is that we should not accept the
means
is
that
we
should
not
accept
the
fact that we have so much income and
fact
that
we
have
so
much
income
and
wealth inequality that you got one guy,
wealth
inequality
that
you
got
one
guy
Mr. Musk, owning more wealth than the
Mr
Musk
owning
more
wealth
than
the
bottom 52% of the American people. That
bottom
52
of
the
American
people
That
we have a corrupt campaign finance
we
have
a
corrupt
campaign
finance
system that allows billionaires in both
system
that
allows
billionaires
in
both
parties to determine who wins and who
parties
to
determine
who
wins
and
who
loses elections. Right.
loses
elections
Right
>> Right. And the vision has got to be and
>>
Right
And
the
vision
has
got
to
be
and
I want people to think about this in
I
want
people
to
think
about
this
in
this extraordinarily great country,
this
extraordinarily
great
country
wealthy country, why don't we guarantee
wealthy
country
why
don't
we
guarantee
healthcare to every man, woman and child
healthcare
to
every
man
woman
and
child
that so this is what the rebel needs to
that
so
this
is
what
the
rebel
needs
to
learn. So
learn
So
in this moment all this potential energy
in
this
moment
all
this
potential
energy
there is clearly a thirst in this
there
is
clearly
a
thirst
in
this
country for uh leadership and and and
country
for
uh
leadership
and
and
and
smart politics. You know, I know uh
smart
politics
You
know
I
know
uh
Kamla's book was 107 days, this
Kamla's
book
was
107
days
this
shortened time that she had uh uh to run
shortened
time
that
she
had
uh
uh
to
run
the campaign, but the Democrats have had
the
campaign
but
the
Democrats
have
had
now
now
>> a much longer time frame.
>>
a
much
longer
time
frame
>> Yes.
>>
Yes
>> And yet, to my mind, have not
>>
And
yet
to
my
mind
have
not
articulated
articulated
>> Yes.
>>
Yes
>> a simple clear vision addressing those
>>
a
simple
clear
vision
addressing
those
very things at all.
very
things
at
all
>> In fact, I would go further. There seems
>>
In
fact
I
would
go
further
There
seems
to be a whole thing where they say,
to
be
a
whole
thing
where
they
say
"Let's not address that vision. What we
Let's
not
address
that
vision
What
we
need to do is not bother anybody and be
need
to
do
is
not
bother
anybody
and
be
just totally
just
totally
>> You're not far from wrong. I And and
>>
You're
not
far
from
wrong
I
And
and
it's a conscious decision. You're I
it's
a
conscious
decision
You're
I
mean, look,
mean
look
>> it's my GPS. I'm near right.
>>
it's
my
GPS
I'm
near
right
>> Look, um and a lot of that gets back to
>>
Look
um
and
a
lot
of
that
gets
back
to
money. Basically, if you're a political
money
Basically
if
you're
a
political
party, you got to make a decision. Do
party
you
got
to
make
a
decision
Do
you go where the money is, where the
you
go
where
the
money
is
where
the
billionaires are, where the super PACs
billionaires
are
where
the
super
PACs
are and kind of do what these guys want?
are
and
kind
of
do
what
these
guys
want
Or do you go where the working class and
Or
do
you
go
where
the
working
class
and
the middle class of this country are?
the
middle
class
of
this
country
are
And those are people who are hurting,
And
those
are
people
who
are
hurting
who want real change. You know, I'll
who
want
real
change
You
know
I'll
give Donald Trump, he may be crazy, he
give
Donald
Trump
he
may
be
crazy
he
may be a pathological liar, but he's not
may
be
a
pathological
liar
but
he's
not
stupid. And
stupid
And
>> I'm going to say something. That's a
>>
I'm
going
to
say
something
That's
a
rather passive aggressive comment. I
rather
passive
aggressive
comment
I
think
think
it's classic.
it's
classic
>> All right. But what I mean by that is
>>
All
right
But
what
I
mean
by
that
is
the message that he gives off in one way
the
message
that
he
gives
off
in
one
way
or another is the system is broken.
or
another
is
the
system
is
broken
Right.
Right
>> Yes.
>>
Yes
>> And I alone can fix the system. Well,
>>
And
I
alone
can
fix
the
system
Well
the truth is the system is broken. He is
the
truth
is
the
system
is
broken
He
is
making it worse. But the Democrats have
making
it
worse
But
the
Democrats
have
got to acknowledge that the system is
got
to
acknowledge
that
the
system
is
broken.
broken
>> I'll go you one better. You know, if you
>>
I'll
go
you
one
better
You
know
if
you
think about because your message has
think
about
because
your
message
has
always been consistent. You've spoken
always
been
consistent
You've
spoken
this way since you first came on the
this
way
since
you
first
came
on
the
scene for a very long time and you've
scene
for
a
very
long
time
and
you've
always been clear about it.
always
been
clear
about
it
You could almost make a case that the
You
could
almost
make
a
case
that
the
true inheritor of the Sanders revolution
true
inheritor
of
the
Sanders
revolution
is Trump. He's the most socialist
is
Trump
He's
the
most
socialist
president of my lifetime. Taking a
president
of
my
lifetime
Taking
a
percentage of companies to do business,
percentage
of
companies
to
do
business
that's a Bernie Sanders idea.
that's
a
Bernie
Sanders
idea
>> Yeah. Doing a a Trump RX where the
>>
Yeah
Doing
a
a
Trump
RX
where
the
government is involved in in selling
government
is
involved
in
in
selling
pharmaceuticals, that's a Bernie Sanders
pharmaceuticals
that's
a
Bernie
Sanders
idea. It's not only his his some of his
idea
It's
not
only
his
his
some
of
his
policies, some of his other policies,
policies
some
of
his
other
policies
let's not forget is throwing 15 million
let's
not
forget
is
throwing
15
million
people off the healthcare they are have
people
off
the
healthcare
they
are
have
in doubling healthcare premiums.
in
doubling
healthcare
premiums
>> He's not perfect
>>
He's
not
perfect
>> and giving a say he was perfect
>>
and
giving
a
say
he
was
perfect
>> and giving a trillion dollars of tax
>>
and
giving
a
trillion
dollars
of
tax
breaks is the one.
breaks
is
the
one
>> Is it frustrating that this this the
>>
Is
it
frustrating
that
this
this
the
thing that you fought for your whole
thing
that
you
fought
for
your
whole
career Democrats are the ones who run
career
Democrats
are
the
ones
who
run
away from scared and he's embraced some
away
from
scared
and
he's
embraced
some
of it.
of
it
>> Yeah. Yeah, that's true. All right. So,
>>
Yeah
Yeah
that's
true
All
right
So
what do we got to do? I mean, first of
what
do
we
got
to
do
I
mean
first
of
all, you got to acknowledge bloody
all
you
got
to
acknowledge
bloody
reality. Health care system is broken.
reality
Health
care
system
is
broken
Boom.
Boom
>> All right. We need to do what every
>>
All
right
We
need
to
do
what
every
other major country does. Guarantee
other
major
country
does
Guarantee
healthcare to every man, woman, and
healthcare
to
every
man
woman
and
child. Take on the greed of the
child
Take
on
the
greed
of
the
pharmaceutical industry and the
pharmaceutical
industry
and
the
insurance companies. Okay. We're
insurance
companies
Okay
We're
spending more than enough money to
spending
more
than
enough
money
to
guarantee good quality healthcare to
guarantee
good
quality
healthcare
to
every person. All right.
every
person
All
right
All right. What else do you got to do?
All
right
What
else
do
you
got
to
do
We need the Democratic party to be very
We
need
the
Democratic
party
to
be
very
clear. The campaign system, current
clear
The
campaign
system
current
campaign finance system is broken. You
campaign
finance
system
is
broken
You
got to get rid of Citizens United. You
got
to
get
rid
of
Citizens
United
You
got to move to public funding of
got
to
move
to
public
funding
of
elections. Give everybody a chance to
elections
Give
everybody
a
chance
to
participate in our democracy.
participate
in
our
democracy
>> Right. All right. If if you were
>>
Right
All
right
If
if
you
were
triaging
triaging
So, let's say you're triaging uh that
So
let's
say
you're
triaging
uh
that
idea because Citizens United, look,
idea
because
Citizens
United
look
those decisions about corporations being
those
decisions
about
corporations
being
people and money being speech make
people
and
money
being
speech
make
things very difficult. But they do seem
things
very
difficult
But
they
do
seem
like generational plays to try and
like
generational
plays
to
try
and
reverse things like that. This health
reverse
things
like
that
This
health
care thing seems more immediate. Is that
care
thing
seems
more
immediate
Is
that
if you're triaging the aatient of
if
you're
triaging
the
aatient
of
America, what's what's the first thing
America
what's
what's
the
first
thing
you want to address?
you
want
to
address
>> I happen, you know, I've always been
>>
I
happen
you
know
I've
always
been
deeply concerned about healthcare as a
deeply
concerned
about
healthcare
as
a
human right.
human
right
>> Right.
>>
Right
>> And this is something that is so doable.
>>
And
this
is
something
that
is
so
doable
We are the odd guy out as a country. I
We
are
the
odd
guy
out
as
a
country
I
live 50 miles away from Canada. You
live
50
miles
away
from
Canada
You
spend a month in a hospital in Canada.
spend
a
month
in
a
hospital
in
Canada
You know what the bill is when you come
You
know
what
the
bill
is
when
you
come
out? Zero. They spend half as much per
out
Zero
They
spend
half
as
much
per
capita as we do on healthcare. They
capita
as
we
do
on
healthcare
They
guarantee healthcare to all of their
guarantee
healthcare
to
all
of
their
people. This can be done. Absolutely
people
This
can
be
done
Absolutely
doable. The other thing we could do,
doable
The
other
thing
we
could
do
young people today finding it extremely
young
people
today
finding
it
extremely
hard to buy their own home. Cost of
hard
to
buy
their
own
home
Cost
of
housing is off the charts. Why aren't we
housing
is
off
the
charts
Why
aren't
we
building four or five million units of
building
four
or
five
million
units
of
lowincome and affordable housing? Well,
lowincome
and
affordable
housing
Well
to to be fair,
to
to
be
fair
we are building one or two four or five
we
are
building
one
or
two
four
or
five
million dollar homes. So, I think that
million
dollar
homes
So
I
think
that
on average
on
average
>> Yeah. Well, that's the point. That's a
>>
Yeah
Well
that's
the
point
That's
a
fair point.
fair
point
>> But let me ask you this question then
>>
But
let
me
ask
you
this
question
then
because this this is where I get in my
because
this
this
is
where
I
get
in
my
head about those prescriptions seem a a
head
about
those
prescriptions
seem
a
a
charismatic leader making a forceful
charismatic
leader
making
a
forceful
case for that would very much appeal to
case
for
that
would
very
much
appeal
to
the American people. But what Democrats
the
American
people
But
what
Democrats
find themselves in a place is we've shut
find
themselves
in
a
place
is
we've
shut
down the government to protect subsidies
down
the
government
to
protect
subsidies
for an insurance marketplace that
for
an
insurance
marketplace
that
funnels $800 billion a year into the
funnels
800
billion
a
year
into
the
pockets of all these insurance
pockets
of
all
these
insurance
companies. Have Democrats boxed
companies
Have
Democrats
boxed
themselves into a corner fighting for a
themselves
into
a
corner
fighting
for
a
system that ultimately to get the thing
system
that
ultimately
to
get
the
thing
that you want that I think the American
that
you
want
that
I
think
the
American
people want, they're going to have to
people
want
they're
going
to
have
to
abandon.
abandon
>> Yes. Look, here's where we are right
>>
Yes
Look
here's
where
we
are
right
now, and I think it's not been made as
now
and
I
think
it's
not
been
made
as
clear as it should. If Trump gets away
clear
as
it
should
If
Trump
gets
away
with what he wants, we are looking at 15
with
what
he
wants
we
are
looking
at
15
million people losing their health
million
people
losing
their
health
insurance. And according to studies,
insurance
And
according
to
studies
John, 50,000 low-income and
John
50000
low-income
and
working-class people dying every year
working-class
people
dying
every
year
unnecessarily
unnecessarily
>> based on lack of accessibility to
>>
based
on
lack
of
accessibility
to
health. Is that what you're low-inccome,
health
Is
that
what
you're
low-inccome
you're working, you know how many
you're
working
you
know
how
many
health, you have a chronic ill, you die.
health
you
have
a
chronic
ill
you
die
That's what they're saying. On top of
That's
what
they're
saying
On
top
of
that, all over the country,
that
all
over
the
country
>> clear you you do die anyway. Just
>>
clear
you
you
do
die
anyway
Just
>> you die anyway. But you don't have to
>>
you
die
anyway
But
you
don't
have
to
die. You don't have to die just because
die
You
don't
have
to
die
just
because
you can't get to a doctor. That is
you
can't
get
to
a
doctor
That
is
disgusting. Right. All right. And then
disgusting
Right
All
right
And
then
on top of that, because of the cuts to
on
top
of
that
because
of
the
cuts
to
the ACA, uh you're looking at uh some 20
the
ACA
uh
you're
looking
at
uh
some
20
plus million people seeing a doubling of
plus
million
people
seeing
a
doubling
of
their premiums at a time when they can't
their
premiums
at
a
time
when
they
can't
even afford healthcare right now. Right.
even
afford
healthcare
right
now
Right
>> All right. So your point is, is this a
>>
All
right
So
your
point
is
is
this
a
good system? No. But we got
good
system
No
But
we
got
>> this is a good system to defend
>>
this
is
a
good
system
to
defend
political capital. But obviously,
political
capital
But
obviously
obviously,
obviously
>> right,
>>
right
>> it is a system designed to make huge
>>
it
is
a
system
designed
to
make
huge
profits for the insurance companies and
profits
for
the
insurance
companies
and
the drug companies, right? Period. We
the
drug
companies
right
Period
We
have got to move to a Medicare for all
have
got
to
move
to
a
Medicare
for
all
singlepayer program. Absolutely.
singlepayer
program
Absolutely
Will
Will
Is that something in in your caucus that
Is
that
something
in
in
your
caucus
that
when when when that's raised, what are
when
when
when
that's
raised
what
are
the objections that come back to you?
the
objections
that
come
back
to
you
Now, I'm assuming that within even your
Now
I'm
assuming
that
within
even
your
caucus with the Democratic uh party that
caucus
with
the
Democratic
uh
party
that
you're considered an outlier in in those
you're
considered
an
outlier
in
in
those
kinds of things. Maybe more people are
kinds
of
things
Maybe
more
people
are
coming along there. What is their
coming
along
there
What
is
their
reluctance?
reluctance
>> Well, the irony is in the caucus I am.
>>
Well
the
irony
is
in
the
caucus
I
am
Outside of the caucus, in the real
Outside
of
the
caucus
in
the
real
world, I am not.
world
I
am
not
>> That's the point.
>>
That's
the
point
>> Yeah. All right. I think there is, oh,
>>
Yeah
All
right
I
think
there
is
oh
Bernie, it's too radical.
Bernie
it's
too
radical
Oh, Bernie, you know, got money from
Oh
Bernie
you
know
got
money
from
insurance companies, drug companies, you
insurance
companies
drug
companies
you
know, all that stuff. We're getting all
know
all
that
stuff
We're
getting
all
kinds of opposition.
kinds
of
opposition
>> Will people ever say to you like,
>>
Will
people
ever
say
to
you
like
Bernie, I'd love to do that, but you
Bernie
I'd
love
to
do
that
but
you
don't understand. Etna's throwing me a
don't
understand
Etna's
throwing
me
a
party. You can't you I can't. Well,
party
You
can't
you
I
can't
Well
these are non-verbal communications.
these
are
non-verbal
communications
>> I mean,
>>
I
mean
>> little nudge nudge wink wink.
>>
little
nudge
nudge
wink
wink
>> Yeah. I mean, look, these guys I last
>>
Yeah
I
mean
look
these
guys
I
last
count there were 1,500
count
there
were
1500
lobbyists from the pharmaceutical
lobbyists
from
the
pharmaceutical
industry in Washington DC. Okay. That's
industry
in
Washington
DC
Okay
That's
why you are paying by far the highest
why
you
are
paying
by
far
the
highest
prices in the world for prescription
prices
in
the
world
for
prescription
drugs. All right. But then you got other
drugs
All
right
But
then
you
got
other
things. 70 years ago, I don't know how
things
70
years
ago
I
don't
know
how
many people know this. P most or many
many
people
know
this
P
most
or
many
public colleges and universities were
public
colleges
and
universities
were
tuition free in America.
tuition
free
in
America
>> Sure. My parents went city college.
>>
Sure
My
parents
went
city
college
>> There you go. Great universities.
>>
There
you
go
Great
universities
California highest quality education
California
highest
quality
education
tuition free.
tuition
free
>> And now workingclass families can't
>>
And
now
workingclass
families
can't
afford to send their kids to college.
afford
to
send
their
kids
to
college
>> But again, this gets to the Democratic
>>
But
again
this
gets
to
the
Democratic
solutions have never been to directly
solutions
have
never
been
to
directly
provide. It's always been a subsidy to a
provide
It's
always
been
a
subsidy
to
a
middleman. But what happens is when the
middleman
But
what
happens
is
when
the
government promises endless funds to
government
promises
endless
funds
to
insurance companies or private
insurance
companies
or
private
universities without any cost controls
universities
without
any
cost
controls
and Trump seems to understand this
and
Trump
seems
to
understand
this
prices rise far beyond the rate of
prices
rise
far
beyond
the
rate
of
inflation and we've seen it in tuition
inflation
and
we've
seen
it
in
tuition
and we've seen it in uh pharmaceutical
and
we've
seen
it
in
uh
pharmaceutical
and we've seen it in in health care. So,
and
we've
seen
it
in
in
health
care
So
my question is, will Democrats recognize
my
question
is
will
Democrats
recognize
the poison pill that they've often
the
poison
pill
that
they've
often
placed into well-intentioned policy?
placed
into
well-intentioned
policy
>> Right. Right. What they end up doing is
>>
Right
Right
What
they
end
up
doing
is
coming up with very complicated
coming
up
with
very
complicated
proposals. You make $48,964,
proposals
You
make
48964
>> you will get this thing. You make a
>>
you
will
get
this
thing
You
make
a
dollar more, you're finished. And blah
dollar
more
you're
finished
And
blah
blah blah blah. Look, we have got to
blah
blah
blah
Look
we
have
got
to
make it simple. In the wealthiest
make
it
simple
In
the
wealthiest
country in the history of the world,
country
in
the
history
of
the
world
should healthcare be a human right? Yes,
should
healthcare
be
a
human
right
Yes
it should be. Should we have the best
it
should
be
Should
we
have
the
best
quality education in the world from
quality
education
in
the
world
from
child care to graduate school? Yes, we
child
care
to
graduate
school
Yes
we
should.
should
>> Right. But these are these are
>>
Right
But
these
are
these
are
>> How do you get Let's get there.
>>
How
do
you
get
Let's
get
there
>> All right. Then the question is All
>>
All
right
Then
the
question
is
All
right. These are
right
These
are
>> I'm writing this down. Sanders.
>>
I'm
writing
this
down
Sanders
>> All right. The Republicans are You're
>>
All
right
The
Republicans
are
You're
getting violent here. You know, you're
getting
violent
here
You
know
you're
>> I get excited when you're around.
>>
I
get
excited
when
you're
around
>> All right.
>>
All
right
uh you know and what we need is a very
uh
you
know
and
what
we
need
is
a
very
simple straightforward agenda which says
simple
straightforward
agenda
which
says
by the way and this is this is really a
by
the
way
and
this
is
this
is
really
a
sticky point. You got to finally say to
sticky
point
You
got
to
finally
say
to
the oligarchs who have never ever had it
the
oligarchs
who
have
never
ever
had
it
so good. They're making money hand over
so
good
They're
making
money
hand
over
fist. All right. And you got to say to
fist
All
right
And
you
got
to
say
to
them, sorry guys, a billion dollars is
them
sorry
guys
a
billion
dollars
is
enough. You ain't going to have 200
enough
You
ain't
going
to
have
200
billion or 300 billion. Try to survive
billion
or
300
billion
Try
to
survive
on be a billion. you're going to start
on
be
a
billion
you're
going
to
start
paying your fair share of taxes.
paying
your
fair
share
of
taxes
And this is like
And
this
is
like
so when you see Donald Trump go to and
so
when
you
see
Donald
Trump
go
to
and
and only in this one area, but go to
and
only
in
this
one
area
but
go
to
them and say, "You're giving me 10% of
them
and
say
You're
giving
me
10
of
your company if we're going to help you
your
company
if
we're
going
to
help
you
out or we're going to do that, but
out
or
we're
going
to
do
that
but
here's the thing, Fizer, you're not
here's
the
thing
Fizer
you're
not
going to charge these people anymore."
going
to
charge
these
people
anymore
Does that change the calculus now for
Does
that
change
the
calculus
now
for
Democrats to govern with more balls?
Democrats
to
govern
with
more
balls
>> I think it does. I think it does. I
>>
I
think
it
does
I
think
it
does
I
mean, they've seen a boldness on the
mean
they've
seen
a
boldness
on
the
part of Trump using his power in a way
part
of
Trump
using
his
power
in
a
way
that we have never seen before. So, I
that
we
have
never
seen
before
So
I
hope it awakens Democrats.
hope
it
awakens
Democrats
>> Yeah.
>>
Yeah
>> To understand.
>>
To
understand
>> You want Luke Skywalker to look at Darth
>>
You
want
Luke
Skywalker
to
look
at
Darth
and go, I could do that.
and
go
I
could
do
that
I could just nicer.
I
could
just
nicer
nicer without the people in the masks.
nicer
without
the
people
in
the
masks
But the revolution, the political
But
the
revolution
the
political
revolution that we need also means an
revolution
that
we
need
also
means
an
involvement. And this is what was so
involvement
And
this
is
what
was
so
exciting about the No Kings Day at 7
exciting
about
the
No
Kings
Day
at
7
million people coming out. We need all
million
people
coming
out
We
need
all
of you
of
you
>> to be involved in this process. It's got
>>
to
be
involved
in
this
process
It's
got
to be a bottom on up revolution, not a
to
be
a
bottom
on
up
revolution
not
a
top down.
top
down
>> No, it it it it makes sense. it. I
>>
No
it
it
it
it
makes
sense
it
I
wonder if we've lost the purpose in the
wonder
if
we've
lost
the
purpose
in
the
sense of, you know, of viewing
sense
of
you
know
of
viewing
government as a bull work. You know,
government
as
a
bull
work
You
know
when the founders design a system and
when
the
founders
design
a
system
and
they talk about checks and balances and
they
talk
about
checks
and
balances
and
congressional checks and judicial and
congressional
checks
and
judicial
and
executive and the balance all there, I
executive
and
the
balance
all
there
I
don't know that they factored in
don't
know
that
they
factored
in
corporate power and I don't know that
corporate
power
and
I
don't
know
that
there's an entity large enough or with
there's
an
entity
large
enough
or
with
enough leverage
enough
leverage
>> to be a counterweight to that type of
>>
to
be
a
counterweight
to
that
type
of
corporate power.
corporate
power
>> You're raising a very important issue.
>>
You're
raising
a
very
important
issue
>> All right.
>>
All
right
I knew I'd get to it at some point.
I
knew
I'd
get
to
it
at
some
point
>> Finally. I've been waiting, John. You
>>
Finally
I've
been
waiting
John
You
finally said something relevant here.
finally
said
something
relevant
here
>> Yes.
>>
Yes
>> Uh, look, I know people say, "Oh, we
>>
Uh
look
I
know
people
say
Oh
we
don't want the government to regulate,
don't
want
the
government
to
regulate
you know, corporate." The truth of the
you
know
corporate
The
truth
of
the
matter is it's quite the opposite right
matter
is
it's
quite
the
opposite
right
now. It is the corporate world. It is
now
It
is
the
corporate
world
It
is
the oligarchs who are regulating the
the
oligarchs
who
are
regulating
the
government. They have far more power,
government
They
have
far
more
power
>> right? And we have got to create a
>>
right
And
we
have
got
to
create
a
political movement, a grassroots
political
movement
a
grassroots
movement which takes control of the
movement
which
takes
control
of
the
future of this country. Let me give you
future
of
this
country
Let
me
give
you
one example. Right now we are in the
one
example
Right
now
we
are
in
the
midst as everybody knows of these the
midst
as
everybody
knows
of
these
the
Musks of the world and Bezos and all
Musks
of
the
world
and
Bezos
and
all
these guys putting hundreds of billions
these
guys
putting
hundreds
of
billions
of dollars into AI and robotics. Right?
of
dollars
into
AI
and
robotics
Right
>> This is going to transform our world.
>>
This
is
going
to
transform
our
world
It's going to transform our economy. In
It's
going
to
transform
our
economy
In
my view, in the view of a number of
my
view
in
the
view
of
a
number
of
economists, it means millions and
economists
it
means
millions
and
millions of workers are going to be
millions
of
workers
are
going
to
be
displaced from their jobs.
displaced
from
their
jobs
>> Who is engaging in that discussion to
>>
Who
is
engaging
in
that
discussion
to
say, "Hey, Mr. Musk, you can't make the
say
Hey
Mr
Musk
you
can't
make
the
decision for the future of humanity. We
decision
for
the
future
of
humanity
We
are going to make the future." And that
are
going
to
make
the
future
And
that
is if AI works, it's going to work for
is
if
AI
works
it's
going
to
work
for
working people, not just billionaires.
working
people
not
just
billionaires
>> I'll go you one further.
>>
I'll
go
you
one
further
>> Why are you always going me one further?
>>
Why
are
you
always
going
me
one
further
I'm not round.
I'm
not
round
>> I'll go you one further with this. Let's
>>
I'll
go
you
one
further
with
this
Let's
let's get really radical. You know,
let's
get
really
radical
You
know
these AI uh data farms are going to need
these
AI
uh
data
farms
are
going
to
need
more and more electricity. Absolutely.
more
and
more
electricity
Absolutely
And these uh uh uh oligarchs or
And
these
uh
uh
uh
oligarchs
or
billionaire or the people that control
billionaire
or
the
people
that
control
that are trying to cut deals
that
are
trying
to
cut
deals
>> to get cheaper electricity for
>>
to
get
cheaper
electricity
for
themselves even though that's going to
themselves
even
though
that's
going
to
raise prices for the rest of us.
raise
prices
for
the
rest
of
us
>> Absolutely. And it's being they're being
>>
Absolutely
And
it's
being
they're
being
resisted all over the country. It's it's
resisted
all
over
the
country
It's
it's
electricity. It's water. Scarce water is
electricity
It's
water
Scarce
water
is
going to be used.
going
to
be
used
>> I like both of those.
>>
I
like
both
of
those
>> All right. But the bottom line is
>>
All
right
But
the
bottom
line
is
these technologies are going to
these
technologies
are
going
to
transform the world. We have got to make
transform
the
world
We
have
got
to
make
sure that they work for working people,
sure
that
they
work
for
working
people
not just enrich the people on top. What
not
just
enrich
the
people
on
top
What
does that mean? Well, among other
does
that
mean
Well
among
other
things, if we increase worker
things
if
we
increase
worker
productivity, we can lower the work week
productivity
we
can
lower
the
work
week
from 40 hours a week to at least 32
from
40
hours
a
week
to
at
least
32
hours a week. All right? But we have in
hours
a
week
All
right
But
we
have
in
many ways, you know, if if you look at
many
ways
you
know
if
if
you
look
at
productivity over time, productivity for
productivity
over
time
productivity
for
the American worker has shot through the
the
American
worker
has
shot
through
the
roof. American workers are unbelievably
roof
American
workers
are
unbelievably
productive. That's my point. But wages
productive
That's
my
point
But
wages
have not.
have
not
>> That is the profound point. Over the
>>
That
is
the
profound
point
Over
the
last 52 years, with all of the increase
last
52
years
with
all
of
the
increase
in worker productivity and technology,
in
worker
productivity
and
technology
the average American worker, blue collar
the
average
American
worker
blue
collar
work, earning less today than he did
work
earning
less
today
than
he
did
then. That's insane. Why are you able to
then
That's
insane
Why
are
you
able
to
make these cases so easily and talk like
make
these
cases
so
easily
and
talk
like
a normal human being and and these other
a
normal
human
being
and
and
these
other
I mean that's part of the problem in the
I
mean
that's
part
of
the
problem
in
the
Democratic party sometimes you listen to
Democratic
party
sometimes
you
listen
to
them and you just you can almost see the
them
and
you
just
you
can
almost
see
the
consultant behind their eye going don't
consultant
behind
their
eye
going
don't
frame it like that talk like a person
frame
it
like
that
talk
like
a
person
you know I I think sadly it gets back to
you
know
I
I
think
sadly
it
gets
back
to
money again you know if you don't want
money
again
you
know
if
you
don't
want
to say things that antagonize your
to
say
things
that
antagonize
your
campaign donors
campaign
donors
Then you have to wiggle them.
Then
you
have
to
wiggle
them
>> Trust me, the United States government
>>
Trust
me
the
United
States
government
is always going to be a trough. It It's
is
always
going
to
be
a
trough
It
It's
just a question of people are always
just
a
question
of
people
are
always
going to make corporations are always
going
to
make
corporations
are
always
going to be able to make a huge profit
going
to
be
able
to
make
a
huge
profit
off of the contracts that come from the
off
of
the
contracts
that
come
from
the
American government. The question is,
American
government
The
question
is
can we deliver those contracts with less
can
we
deliver
those
contracts
with
less
corruption? You know, everybody talks
corruption
You
know
everybody
talks
about waste, fraud, and abuse as though
about
waste
fraud
and
abuse
as
though
that's only done from people down the
that's
only
done
from
people
down
the
chain, people that get, you know, food
chain
people
that
get
you
know
food
stamps and uh all those things. They
stamps
and
uh
all
those
things
They
don't even look at the real corruption
don't
even
look
at
the
real
corruption
at the contractor level, at the all the
at
the
contractor
level
at
the
all
the
subsidy level.
subsidy
level
>> John, the Pentagon, I voted against
>>
John
the
Pentagon
I
voted
against
this, but Congress is going to pass a
this
but
Congress
is
going
to
pass
a
trillion dollar
trillion
dollar
>> trillion for the military.
>>
trillion
for
the
military
>> The Pentagon
>>
The
Pentagon
>> never passed an audit.
>>
never
passed
an
audit
>> Exactly. They have the only government
>>
Exactly
They
have
the
only
government
agent, major government agency not to
agent
major
government
agency
not
to
pass an audit. No one denies that there
pass
an
audit
No
one
denies
that
there
is massive way. They don't even know
is
massive
way
They
don't
even
know
what they own. All right. And they're
what
they
own
All
right
And
they're
paying the, you know, the the the
paying
the
you
know
the
the
the
salaries of the people of Loheed Martin
salaries
of
the
people
of
Loheed
Martin
and all this other stuff off the charts.
and
all
this
other
stuff
off
the
charts
So your point is well taken and uh we
So
your
point
is
well
taken
and
uh
we
got to take a look at at the incredible
got
to
take
a
look
at
at
the
incredible
greed. You know these people on top are
greed
You
know
these
people
on
top
are
very religious people. Do you know that?
very
religious
people
Do
you
know
that
>> Oh very religious people their religion
>>
Oh
very
religious
people
their
religion
is greed.
is
greed
>> Yeah.
>>
Yeah
>> They worship at the altar of money
>>
They
worship
at
the
altar
of
money
leverage. They got to use it.
leverage
They
got
to
use
it
>> Godamn right.
>>
Godamn
right
>> So so so let's talk about this in in
>>
So
so
so
let's
talk
about
this
in
in
conclusion. Look, you've been doing this
conclusion
Look
you've
been
doing
this
a long time.
a
long
time
>> Couple of years
>>
Couple
of
years
>> is there. A couple of years now.
>>
is
there
A
couple
of
years
now
I want to know in your mind, you've been
I
want
to
know
in
your
mind
you've
been
in the rooms with these folks, you've
in
the
rooms
with
these
folks
you've
been in the weeds with these folks. What
been
in
the
weeds
with
these
folks
What
is your appraisal of their willingness
is
your
appraisal
of
their
willingness
to recognize this moment, to recognize
to
recognize
this
moment
to
recognize
the potential energy and thirst that
the
potential
energy
and
thirst
that
exists out in this country for true
exists
out
in
this
country
for
true
leadership and simple common sense that
leadership
and
simple
common
sense
that
that reflects a government that reflects
that
reflects
a
government
that
reflects
the needs of its people? What is your
the
needs
of
its
people
What
is
your
sense of
sense
of
>> I have been in the room the door is
>>
I
have
been
in
the
room
the
door
is
locked and you know there are some very
locked
and
you
know
there
are
some
very
very serious discussions about what we
very
serious
discussions
about
what
we
have to do to prevent this country
have
to
do
to
prevent
this
country
becoming an authoritarian society but
becoming
an
authoritarian
society
but
John the answer is not just within the
John
the
answer
is
not
just
within
the
room of the people currently elected
room
of
the
people
currently
elected
what we are seeing all over this country
what
we
are
seeing
all
over
this
country
right now are great young people like
right
now
are
great
young
people
like
Mr. Mandani right here in the city of
Mr
Mandani
right
here
in
the
city
of
New York. All right. And it's not just
New
York
All
right
And
it's
not
just
him. You're beginning to see good
him
You're
beginning
to
see
good
candidates who have the guts to say, "I
candidates
who
have
the
guts
to
say
I
am going to take on the oligarchs. I am
am
going
to
take
on
the
oligarchs
I
am
going to stand with the working class."
going
to
stand
with
the
working
class
That is what we have got to develop in
That
is
what
we
have
got
to
develop
in
this country.
this
country
>> Bernie Sanders, the book is fighting.
>>
Bernie
Sanders
the
book
is
fighting
They can't thank you enough. Bernie
They
can't
thank
you
enough
Bernie
Sanders, everybody.
Sanders
everybody
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